When should blizz re-tune raids, pre-raid BiS and raid gear (if they do at all).
I'm on the fence, on the one hand if they do it before you would expect them to do the usual "tune and test" maybe even closed beta? If they did pre-tune or change gear stats I would want to see more obscure stat options for hybrid or off-meta specs (agil, intel and stam on mail for example). Time gating raids might be the only option, since it would give them significantly more time to focus on tuning each raid before they're released.
However if they wait for community feedback it might be closer to the difficulty everyone remembers or wants. You could end up frustrating players who put time into getting BiS only for it to change. And of course you have to take into count the players who will troll any vote they put up.
Its a weird spot to be in but I think I trust blizz'z balance team more than the community. Maybe a year after launch I would have more faith in the community but for now there's just too many hypesters.
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I trust blizz'zWe can't trust Blizzard for anything, if we trust Blizzard we get WoD/Legion all over again.
If they ever do any kind of changes or retunning, it needs to be done by the Nostalrius team or someone with experience in Vanilla.
I'm gonna have to respectfully disagree. We shouldn't look at Blizzard as a single monolithic entity with one mind and one purpose. I'm sure if they were to delegate the right people to the job with the right vision in mind they could do just fine.Syturio wrote: ↑6 years agoNo... no!Code: Select all
I trust blizz'z
We can't trust Blizzard for anything, if we trust Blizzard we get WoD/Legion all over again.
If they ever do any kind of changes or retunning, it needs to be done by the Nostalrius team or someone with experience in Vanilla.
That was me by the way. For some reason I got logged out while typing the response.
I still believe that Blizzard has certain sanity in terms of reincarnating Vanilla - especially with all the hype and debates going on about the potential changes, which might break the end product. However, we have to understand that operating Vanilla patches in the same way it did back in 2004-2006 might not work, simply because we already know the future - the decisions which were correct and those, which were a total miss. We cannot actually believe that irrational itemization as it looks from today's perspective was made that way intentionally (see cloth items with str.) It was unintentional at that time.
I think if Blizzard states that they are going to keep to "no changes" principle, yet commit to their high standards of polished product, we should expect re-tuning from the very beginning. As I said before - we already know the future. Would you spend your DKP for a slot-filler when expecting it to become less valuable after certain patch? You already know it would happen. Same thing - attempts to acquire items, which are absolutely crappy now, but will become much stronger in the future. This would look almost like a comedy club.
I don't think they should tune items/raids at all. The point of the project is to preserve the Vanilla experience, how would you intend to keep it that way if you changed it that much. What makes you think there is a need of tuning it anyways?
You suggest that they keep the item changes timeline as it was implemented originally, in spite of the fact that it will be publicly known when and how item stats will change? Don't you feel there is a certain issue here?
No, I dont see any issue at all, what is wrong with that?
Well, for example, some high-level epic items or loot will be considered useless even if the stats are OK at that time-point, due to the fact that they are prone to change in the future (and we know exactly when and how it will be changed). On the other hand, garbage items today will be looked forward to acquire, knowing that at patch 1.X they are going to steeply rise in value as stats are going to be altered.
I agree that this is not totally game breaking, yet it would impact the gameplay for sure. Especially gearing strategy during raids. Don't you think?
What makes you trust Blizzard? The same company that ruined WoW and gave us MoP/WoD/Legion...Guest wrote: ↑6 years agoI'm sure if they were to delegate the right people to the job with the right vision in mind they could do just fine.
If they knew how to hire the right people we would have UPDATES on Classic by now... it's been what, 7+ months? And still not a single word, shameful coming from a multi-billionaire company.
Our Community Manager for WoW:Classic is inactive and never post anything, you check his Twitter feed and is full of other games non-related to Blizzard, that a alone is a huge red flag they have no clue how to hire the right people.
I do hope Classic succeeds and they do hire the right people for Classic, but at the moment i have no faith in anyone besides Nostalrius Team, specially regarding changes/tunning.
Changing the stats would make it more explorable and give more space for theorycrafting but it would change the game completely. People who never tried Vanilla might want to try true Vanilla experience, by this you would make a different game and so they could not say that they have finally experienced what it was like (they would just have played Vanilla version 2). Although I personally would probably like any changes to the game as I have already experienced some aspects of Vanilla on private servers I think recreating Vanilla experience as it was patch progression wise would make it more enjoyable even with original values which are known. I believe that preserving it the way it was is important. Maybe we could have some changes after we cleared Naxx, maybe bring patch 1.13Razor wrote: ↑6 years ago
Well, for example, some high-level epic items or loot will be considered useless even if the stats are OK at that time-point, due to the fact that they are prone to change in the future (and we know exactly when and how it will be changed). On the other hand, garbage items today will be looked forward to acquire, knowing that at patch 1.X they are going to steeply rise in value as stats are going to be altered.
I agree that this is not totally game breaking, yet it would impact the gameplay for sure. Especially gearing strategy during raids. Don't you think?
I should have been clearer in the post but the general consensus for a re-tune is to fix gear and raids that became obsolete in later patches. Without a re-tune players would completely bypass entire areas. I'm not for changing any original content however if it means that all raids and content stay relevant then I would probably be ok with it.
If I had to choose between internet trolls and paid employees I would choose paid employees every time. Blizzard has made it clear that they don't plan to work with the Nost team.Syturio wrote: ↑6 years agoNo... no!Code: Select all
I trust blizz'z
We can't trust Blizzard for anything, if we trust Blizzard we get WoD/Legion all over again.
If they ever do any kind of changes or retunning, it needs to be done by the Nostalrius team or someone with experience in Vanilla.
I believe that in later patches there were changes to loads of items as well as adding relevant content into the ''less visited'' areas already. What items for example do you mean? There are always many incentives even for high-end raiding guilds to return to ''non relevant'' raids such as MC as there is always a possibility of acquiring the bindings or other materials. Blizzard made even the quests make you go back to those instances such as the AQ opening quest chain which brought you to all of the raids multiple times. There is always something to do in those ''obsolete'' instances so I wouldn't say it is neccessary to tune anything. But if you also meant tuning the difficulty of MC for those guilds that find the raid too easy to bother with, tell that to the guilds who have just started to progress MC, they would have harder content to experience then their predecessors. Maybe I just misunderstood what you meant.Candletaker wrote: ↑6 years agoI should have been clearer in the post but the general consensus for a re-tune is to fix gear and raids that became obsolete in later patches. Without a re-tune players would completely bypass entire areas. I'm not for changing any original content however if it means that all raids and content stay relevant then I would probably be ok with it.
Couldn't agree more with this.
